Biathlon 2019 - 2020 Discussion Thread

[Grassmarket 2,847]

11 minutes ago, Vojthas said:

Well, I'm the generation which doesn't know other pentathlon than the one with laser and this sound is quite characteristic (at least for me). About reloading manually - it is reloaded manually. In pentathlon you need to lower your shooting arm before doing that. In rifle it's a button-like... something you push with your thumb. At least in the version I used (it also had quite an easy aiming system). It all can be reconstructed for biathlon purposes, if needed.

 

No, it’s not quite automatic. Obviously there is the relay which requires a manual reload, but even in magazine shooting you quite often get mis-loads, or failure to eject empties;  a result of poor technique which is rightly punished by a time penalty.  As I say in the lead shot days in MP you used to see even big names take up to 60 secs to get their 5 targets which obviously produced bigger result swings. But now even a really bad shoot is only about 30 secs.

[Vojthas 947]

3 minutes ago, dcro said:

 

But how do you enter an extra bullet during the relays in laser rifle?

I think it's the matter of software - in pentathlon you don't fire five times, you fire until you shoot the target five times (or until 500 secs pass by). I don't know, how it can work in biathlon, maybe it will change, so not until five shots fired but until five meeting the target - then you have an extra "bullets" not only in relay. But it can be also five fired and then you go further and additional "bullets" in the relay - then the software should be also in the rifle, not only in target - a little bit challenge for a producers.

[Vojthas 947]

Just now, Grassmarket said:

 

No, it’s not quite automatic. Obviously there is the relay which requires a manual reload, but even in magazine shooting you quite often get mis-loads, or failure to eject empties;  a result of poor technique which is rightly punished by a time penalty.  As I say in the lead shot days in MP you used to see even big names take up to 60 secs to get their 5 targets which obviously produced bigger result swings. But now even a really bad shoot is only about 30 secs.

50 secs. And you might be surprised, but also nowadays technical failures happen - Berlin 2015 Worlds, where the technical problems lead to the postponing the men's relay's laser-run (then yet under the name "combined event") and building a very provisional "roofing" above targets (I remember talks between athletes sharing their experience about the new pistols that were introduced that year), Olympic trial in Rio in the torrential rain thanks to which Claudia Cesarini surprisingly won or even this year's Gubaydullina's target failing at the World Championships in the women's individual final.

[dcro 10,192]

Just now, Vojthas said:

I think it's the matter of software - in pentathlon you don't fire five times, you fire until you shoot the target five times (or until 500 secs pass by). I don't know, how it can work in biathlon, maybe it will change, so not until five shots fired but until five meeting the target - then you have an extra "bullets" not only in relay. But it can be also five fired and then you go further and additional "bullets" in the relay - then the software should be also in the rifle, not only in target - a little bit challenge for a producers.

Nevertheless, athletes would not have to enter physical, extra bullets into the rifle, so that would remove something fairly significant. Then there is also the wind factor... Obviously it doesn't effect a beam of light. And finally the whole software thing. Imagine a software error directly impacting an outcome of a race?

 

I'll just keep the laser rifles as far away as possible from biathlon range...

 

 

 

 

[Vojthas 947]

Just now, dcro said:

Nevertheless, athletes would not have to enter physical, extra bullets into the rifle, so that would remove something fairly significant. Then there is also the wind factor... Obviously it doesn't effect a beam of light.

If it's about changing the proportion of times - why not introduce 10 target to shoot instead of five? That would also give more chances for a miss. And not exactly in the shape of 10 circles, but one circle to meet 10 times. That would create an opportunity to have place for more than 30 athletes - maybe that would increase the number of starters in the mass start races?

1 minute ago, dcro said:

And finally the whole software thing. Imagine a software error directly impacting an outcome of a race?

And what about the rifle failure? It's the same. That's what we talk about with @Grassmarket

[Olympian1010 7,583]

I’m a huge fan of the laser run in modern pentathlon, but we should definitely keep biathlon the way it is. I’m sure they could make bullets without lead should that ever become an issue.

[dcro 10,192]

8 minutes ago, Vojthas said:

If it's about changing the proportion of times - why not introduce 10 target to shoot instead of five? That would also give more chances for a miss. And not exactly in the shape of 10 circles, but one circle to meet 10 times. That would create an opportunity to have place for more than 30 athletes - maybe that would increase the number of starters in the mass start races?

 

But in the process it would kill the experience for the live audience. Watching athletes shoot the same circle 10 times seems rather dull.

[Vojthas 947]

Just now, dcro said:

 

But in the process it would kill the experience for the live audience. Watching athletes shoot the same circle 10 times seems rather dull.

What's the difference, when you have 10 lights above, turning red or green if the target is missed or met?

[RobtheAggie 340]

Wow, who knew a poorly worded article would cause so much discussion.  I love the 5 targets, the reloading, the wind, all of it.  

[hckošice 13,339]

I am at 100% for the old system. I think biathlon should remains as it actually is. even maybe returning to it´s real roots, pity it´s looking more and more clear that the real biathlon "the individual" is going to die soon..

 

Also Modern Pentathlon was actually the real modern pentathlon in the past when the competition lasted complete 5 days !

 

I think I already wrote it somewhere here before, when I was reading as a young child during the summer holidays at my grandpas house a book of the Seoul 1988 olympics, I remember the part about modern pentathlon, which started with a joke between two journalists. The first one asking "hey, do you know, which olympic competition currently lasts the longest ? Marathon ? 50km Race walk or road cycling race ?" the other journalist answered "I know it´s a trap from you, none of them, the answer is the Modern Pentathlon Fencing part"

 

In fact the fencing started around 06:00AM to finish around midnight. and the next day the athletes had to return to the stadium again for swimming. Nowadays MP with that combined event to finish it is so sad. at least for me.

 

Poor Coubertin