[OFF TOPIC] Politics Thread

[heywoodu 15,141]

10 minutes ago, Olympian1010 said:

Minorities have never fared well in European history . This xenophobia (and rise of populism internationally) is really worrying. I

Yeah...not only in European history though. Not at all.

 

By the way, when an alarming number of reactions to something like this are basically threats of violence, it does kinda make one think of a ban as a necessary evil. We shouldn't exactly go like "oh they're threatening with violence if they don't get their way, let's forget it".

Edited August 1, 2019 by heywoodu

[Monzanator 4,502]

27 minutes ago, Olympian1010 said:

Minorities have never fared well in European history . This xenophobia (and rise of populism internationally) is really worrying. I

 

And I'm sure lipstick & bikinis wouldn't fly in places like Yemen or Saudi Arabia but nobody calls this xenophobia

 

Ottoman Empire has tried to conquer Europe but thankfully failed in their plans.

[Monzanator 4,502]

20 minutes ago, heywoodu said:

Yeah...not only in European history though. Not at all.

 

By the way, when an alarming number of reactions to something like this are basically threats of violence, it does kinda make one think of a ban as a necessary evil. We shouldn't exactly go like "oh they're threatening with violence if they don't get their way, let's forget it".

 

Minority rule has never worked. The colonial empires have crumbled under it's own weight, likewise communism and then we had apartheid as well.

[Gianlu33 4,559]

Today we'll have an important by-election in Wales. LibDem leading the polls and they can sweap the seat at the Conservative. With a lose the conservative will lose the majority

[Dolby 735]

2 hours ago, Olympian1010 said:

 I believe you may be referring to baklava when you talk about the English word for the ski masks. I mean European countries are only passing these laws to ban burqas. If Christians wore full face coverings this would have never come about. Aren’t there some super religious Dutch groups that have women wear head coverings?  I just can’t wait for Islamic countries to start banning Christian things because this is definitely the route we should take as a planet towards globalization.

There is a big difference in head coverings and face coverings from security point of view. I think in the present ban, even Muslim women will be allowed to wear Abayas which are head coverings similar to bonnet that you talked about for super religious Dutch group.

 

Regarding Islamic countries, you should read about the rights that minorities have in these countries. How many countries that have more than 70% Muslim population are secular in nature? Also, majority of these Islamic countries would rant about such bans in Europe but are defending China while it is cracking down on Muslims in Xinjiang. 

[heywoodu 15,141]

2 hours ago, Olympian1010 said:

Maybe you can help me hear because I really thought a certain group I saw last year was Dutch. Here’s the story.

 

I was camping outside the Yosemite Portal (entrance). At our campground there are all types of tourists. There are a lot of French, Belgian, Dutch, German, and British tourists in the California mountains for some reason. Anyways, they are a few spots a campground reserved for big groups. So when I got back from fishing and took a walk around (because that is the best way to enjoy the magical California summer evenings) I saw this strange group. They looked Amish but spoke either German, French, Dutch, or some other Western European language. Their, what I believe to be, male escorts looked more Eastern European (or actually like the belonged to the mafia) and were always smoking and keeping a close eye on the girls. They did not like that I was curious (especially since one the girls was my age, and looked very nice). I’ve been trying to figure out what the hell I witnessed, but I haven’t been able to come up with a certain group yet. These are the people I was talking about wearing face coverings (though they were more like bonnets if that makes sense). This group almost looked Puritan to me.

Forgot to answer this, but no, it doesn't sound familiar...at all. It sounds more like a dangerous kind of cult that ends up in very unpleasant things. Seriously, that sounds shady as shit.

 

"They looked like they belonged to the mafia." Judging people by the way they look doesn't sound very...you  

[heywoodu 15,141]

16 minutes ago, Dolby said:

There is a big difference in head coverings and face coverings from security point of view. I think in the present ban, even Muslim women will be allowed to wear Abayas

If Google is correct about abayas, yes

 

Our right-wing moron Geert Wilders has already come out today and said the next step is a headscarf ban. Much as I'm in favour of banning things that completely cover the face, I'm just as much against this 'headscarf ban' thing.

[Griff88 1,952]

Classic stuff. When niqab or burqa is going to be banned for security measures, some will against it with the views of "hey, a secular state shouldn't interfere in religious stuff". But they often ignore the fact of non-religious face coverings which are also banned together too.

[heywoodu 15,141]

38 minutes ago, Griff88 said:

Classic stuff. When niqab or burqa is going to be banned for security measures, some will against it with the views of "hey, a secular state shouldn't interfere in religious stuff". But they often ignore the fact of non-religious face coverings which are also banned together too.

Yep. One thing that came to mind: when one sees someone with something face-covering in for example a public institution, employees have to warn this person and tell them to either take the face covering off or leave the premises. If not, police can be called in to do the same and - if someone refuses - give a fine. The problem though: how is police going to get identification from someone who refuses to take off their face covering? That's impossible..

[Agger 1,662]

3 hours ago, Griff88 said:

Classic stuff. When niqab or burqa is going to be banned for security measures, some will against it with the views of "hey, a secular state shouldn't interfere in religious stuff". But they often ignore the fact of non-religious face coverings which are also banned together too.

 

The problem is when it's pretty clear that it's meant against the religious and other kinds are just putin there to make it seem more "neutral". That was the way things happened in Denmark, where we've had the law for a year. When right wing parties talked about it, they didn't even hide that it was meant against the muslims and some exceptions shows the same. Can't say if it is the same in the Netherlands, but here it was a more or less completely symbolic action against islam (especially considering how only very few wear the banned headwear)