Men's Road Cycling UCI Tour de France 2019

[hckošice 15,811]

3 minutes ago, dcro said:

 

One moment Sagan is the medal favorite in MTB, and the next he can't even make the time limit? Decide already, you can't have it both ways.

 

I guess you are just joking right ?  The TdF mountains are something completely different of the classical hills he obviously do very well, and MTB is another totally different cycling, he grew up as a MTB rider, until he was eighteen he competed only on a mountain bike. MTB was expected to be his career, but the team managers of Liquigas pushed him to try the road.

[heywoodu 16,142]

59 minutes ago, hckosice said:

how you can crash on your face ?

Handlebars can brake and you fall flat on your face  

 

Or you just crash rather hard and roll around including on your face.

[heywoodu 16,142]

19 minutes ago, dcro said:

 

One moment Sagan is the medal favorite in MTB

Haha  

[heywoodu 16,142]

8 minutes ago, hckosice said:

 

I guess you are just joking right ?  The TdF mountains are something completely different of the classical hills he obviously do very well, and MTB is another totally different cycling, he grew up as a MTB rider, until he was eighteen he competed only on a mountain bike. MTB was expected to be his career, but the team managers of Liquigas pushed him to try the road.

Come on, of all the sprinters (nowadays with maybe Matthews and Colbrelli as exceptions) Sagan has always shown to be by far the one getting over the mountains the easiest. I mean, that's pretty much how he won 17595 green jerseys  

[hckošice 15,811]

56 minutes ago, heywoodu said:

Haha  

 

Sorry, but I still think he was a medal contender (based from just the fact he was considered as one of the biggest MTB talents when he was junior) and he shown it in Rio basically without training or classic preparation, all his opponents had (who knows what would happen if he avoided the puncture.)

 

55 minutes ago, heywoodu said:

Come on, of all the sprinters (nowadays with maybe Matthews and Colbrelli as exceptions) Sagan has always shown to be by far the one getting over the mountains the easiest. I mean, that's pretty much how he won 17595 green jerseys  

 

we are speaking about TdF mountains finishes, you are certainly not going to compare them with the classical shorter hills I guess.

[heywoodu 16,142]

Just now, hckosice said:

 

Sorry, but I still think he was a medal contender (based from just the fact he was considered as one of the biggest MTB talents when he was junior) and he shown it in Rio basically without training or classic preparation, all his opponents had (who knows what would happen if he avoided the puncture.)

 

 

we are speaking about TdF mountains finishes, you are certainly not going to compare them with the classical shorter hills I guess.

There's a difference between an outside medal contender and a medal favourite. He might and probably would have been one if he had seriously focussed on it the past few years, but he didn't, so he wasn't one.

 

And yes, we are speaking about hard TdF mountain stages. Where he has shown exactly what I said, again and again. He didn't win his green jerseys by being the fastest sprinter, he won them by being a very good sprinter who can outclimb pretty much every other sprinter without serious issues.

[hckošice 15,811]

4 minutes ago, heywoodu said:

There's a difference between an outside medal contender and a medal favourite. He might and probably would have been one if he had seriously focussed on it the past few years, but he didn't, so he wasn't one.

 

And yes, we are speaking about hard TdF mountain stages. Where he has shown exactly what I said, again and again. He didn't win his green jerseys by being the fastest sprinter, he won them by being a very good sprinter who can outclimb pretty much every other sprinter without serious issues.

 

Again buddy, I don´t know if it´s only me who don´t understand or it´s you who is actually still missing the point.

 

outclimb sprinters ? ofc there no doubts, he will always outclimb sprinters since he is not a sprinter. but this is not the topic.

 

we are speaking about his overall climbing skills. he is a good climber in small and shorter hills, one of the best in this type of races (and I include there also the MTB cross-country).  But arguably and obviously awful in higher mountains. get it ? I am pretty sure he finished ALL high mountains stages as part of the gruppeto or a couple of seconds/minutes before or after.  He won his green jerseys being able to win points pretty everywhere but not in the real mountains, they are rather a torture for him and this is why I am always affraid if he´ll make the time limit in the real mountains stages.

 

[hckošice 15,811]

22 minutes ago, heywoodu said:

There's a difference between an outside medal contender and a medal favourite. He might and probably would have been one if he had seriously focussed on it the past few years, but he didn't, so he wasn't one.

 

and just because for you he wasn´t, that still doesn´t mean he wasn´t a medal favourite. I remember some cycling experts including his name among the contenders (even without focussing and without special preparation)

 

but yeah, I think we can agree to disagree

[heywoodu 16,142]

4 minutes ago, hckosice said:

 

Again buddy, I don´t know if it´s only me who don´t understand or it´s you who is actually still missing the point.

 

outclimb sprinters ? ofc there no doubts, he will always outclimb sprinters since he is not a sprinter. but this is not the topic.

 

we are speaking about his overall climbing skills. he is a good climber in small and shorter hills, one of the best in this type of races (and I include there also the MTB cross-country).  But arguably and obviously awful in higher mountains. get it ? I am pretty sure he finished ALL high mountains stages as part of the gruppeto or a couple of seconds/minutes before or after.  He won his green jerseys being able to win points pretty everywhere but not in the real mountains, they are rather a torture for him and this is why I am always affraid if he´ll make the time limit in the real mountains stages.

 

Yes, and I am saying, or trying to say, that he has never shown to be in trouble there, simply finishing with the main group. No big deal.

[heywoodu 16,142]

12 minutes ago, hckosice said:

but yeah, I think we can agree to disagree

I disagree! 

 

(Actually I agree completely  )