kapil857

Does anyone know what seeding system will be followed at the Asian qualifier? Also what about the Olympics itself? I know every cat in Olympics will have 16 wrestlers - so do we still have 4 seeds in every cat or just 2?

As an Indian, we supported you wholeheartedly in the SF against USA, but time now to turn against u guys Need Argentina to win final and take themselves out of the Oly qualifiers...

Thanks a lot...

As someone having done the calculations independently, I can second this... Canada will rise above Chile, SA and Italy and will enter the 8th-11th seed bracket at Oly qualifiers along with China, Korea and USA (assuming that Argentina beats Canada in the final and that Belarus or Russia dont win the European Championships)... High Indian interest here as well, as a Canada win will assure India stays in the 4th-7th seed bracket and thus plays Oly qualifiers at home... Does anyone have a live streaming link by the way??

Since the discussion is currently on TV Shows, if anyone wants to watch something AWESOME but still different from the well known American shows, try the South Korean tv show The Genius. Available here - https://www.reddit.com/r/TheGenius/comments/70jog1/links_to_all_subbed_episodes_of_the_genius_s14/ It is my ALL TIME favorite show and nothing else even comes close (and I watch a LOT of TV). It is a show about people playing different and highly interesting cerebral/social games, which should translate very well for Totallympians with our shared love of sport and competition. The only slight issue is that it's in Korean, means you need to follow the english subtitles. Every one who watches the genius has only 1 of 2 reactions - (1) It is AWESOME or (2) I cudn't handle the subtitles. But it's also the first show I ever watched with subtitles, so it's not that difficult and as long as u can handle them, u'll be in for a treat.

2 please, pretty please

i didnt say shops didnt sell it. We just dont use it.

I'd agree with you but not when the Olympics is involved. If the alternate body wud have been in charge of holding, say, a world championship, federations might have still been strong-armed and stayed loyal to AIBA. But with Olympic participation on the line, they'll show AIBA the finger...

Nah - India is one of the ones missing. We use water, not toilet paper to do our business

But once IOC de-recognizes AIBA, do the national federations really care about AIBA anymore ?? I wud imagine that other than the few favored nations like Russia, Uzbekistan, Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan, no one really likes AIBA or cares about them as they keep robbing their boxers. Some powerful boxing nations like USA, UK and Ireland clearly hate AIBA. Its a little idealistic, and I think eventually all this will just boil over, but the ideal solution for me would be for IOC to suspend AIBA and continue boxing at Tokyo through an interim body. Of course, that doesnt mean only pro boxers. Amateur boxers and proper qualifying tournaments still have to be there. And ideally, a change in the current bogus scoring system.

I always use this https://arena.unitedworldwrestling.org/sport-event/show/b6b4b24a-d22e-11e8-b941-080027548b1b/live

Hmmm ...add 57 kg women to this as well. Completely stacked bottom half (especially bottom quarter), Hungarian girl in top half ended with Bronze...

Heartiest congratulations to Sourav Kothari on winning the World Billiards Championships !! New name added to added to India's long list of world champions in billiards http://www.wbeventsonline.com/?page_id=57&TID=282

Lets get the categories right guys - its 50 kg, 53 kg, 57 kg, 63 kg, 68 kg and 76 kg at Tokyo. The team does look pretty good....

Ah ok...got it...thanks a lot

Actually my question was about the 2nd period - the one where blue made the challenge. The action that happens with Jpn leading 10-8 and 28 secs left to go. It was initially given 2-1, JPN challenged asking for 4, challenge was turned down and hence Russia got extra point to make it 12-10. You say that it your opinion, it was a stupid challenge and a clear 2. Just want to understand why. To me, it seems like a 4 - JPN seems to be the clear attacker till they hit the ground and they seem to go from feet to Russian's back, at which point Russia counters and gets the 1. I am guessing you are saying it was 2 as may be Russia's bottom hit the ground a milisecond before JPN. but seemed like a 4 to me (and of course the JPN coach who challenged).

Thanks for the magnificent analysis. I just watched the match with the analysis by the side just to understand the rules better. So one question - with 30 seconds left to go in the 2nd period, JPN clearly took down Russia onto his back, and both of them were on their feet when action began. So why was it a 2 and not a 4 (JPN coach clearly thought it was 4). Is it because JPN didnt have control with the Russian on his back ?? (Also, in this action, the final result after review WAS 2-1 in favor of Japan, and not 2-2. Russia got the extra point because of a failed challenge from Japan). Also, in the end when they put the Russian in par-terre, shudnt the clock have been reset for 4 seconds to 7 seconds. It didn't matter much but shud have been done right ??

The other big difference is how will the rankings be affected by the hockey pro league and the hockey series. I beleive FIH has still NOT announced how the rankings will work. While India has great rankings right now, if playing in pro league itself can get a lot of points then it can be a problem for India - but yeah, unlikely. And yeah, difference in competition level can be quite a big thing when it gets to the actual olympics (think we'll be fine in the playoffs)..

The supposed "mistaken" challenge clearly also played into the Japanese's hands in terms of rest. Great bout though. Also, Otoguro is World Cadet Champion and had teched Takatani (Japanese silver medalist at Asian Games) in Japanese trials..

So have they always given shiny championship belts to the gold medalists or is this worlds the first time ??

BAJRANG !!!

Just some counterpoints "Please show me any country which dominates senior world championships/ olympics in a sport who does not do well at the junior level in that sport" I have not done any analysis but my first guess here would be USA. Does MUCH better in senior events than junior events, just from what it seems to me. Of course, this doesn't mean they have no junior champs. But in terms of volume and frequency of achievements, especially when compared with other sporting powers, USA wud be found lagging in juniors. I think one of the reasons for that is their inter-collegiate program is excellent. So many stars are discovered only in college, as opposed to in high school. Another prominent example would be Australia. I wud even venture a guess that many European countries, led by UK, wud also follow that template - senior performance better than junior is terms of volume and frequency. "so every junior player may not become a good senior player but almost every great senior player was a great junior player" Not exactly. I'd say every great senior player was at least a "good" junior player. And when u change that distinction, the pool becomes much wider and u dont really know who wud go on to become big. One of the examples I have heard is of Roger Federer. In the juniors, Federer was doubles partner to a guy named Oliver Rochus. Between the two, Rochus was generally considered the far more talented and many people, including Federer's own coach, used to laugh at Federer when he dreamt of becoming the best in the world. Well, we all know how that played out... Another example is our own Srikanth. OGQ had picked Praneeth over him to support when they were young, but they were proved wrong. Viren has even sort of said that it was a mistake but there's no way to avoid it, as Praneeth was much better in the junior days. For me, a far better metric would be when someone graduated to the seniors. Manu Bhaker for eg doesn't have too many junior achievements to show before already being big in seniors. She just waltzed into the senior team at the beginning of the year from nowhere. Hima Das was already India's senior best when she won the U20 world champs. And just abt a year before, she was trying to become a sprinter. A couple of years earlier, she wasn't even into athletics. "shooting unfortunately the junior championships were not regularly conducted till recently " Well that is just not true. They have been conducted since 1994. We won our first junior gold through Navanath Faratade in 2006. Based on a recent interview of him, by around 2008, he was nowhere near national reckoning and essentially quit professional shooting soon after that (though he goes to the annual nationals till today). "so from the crop of great junior players over a 5-6 competitions you would get 1 great senior level player especially in sports like wrestling or boxing" Yes that is probably the more likely conversion rate. Unfortunately doesn't add up to "I believe in statistics if we have 20-24 medals today 5-6 years from today we will have at least 12-15 medals at the senior olympics". To provide an extreme analogy, I was recently thinking that winning a junior world title is may be like topping ur 10th standard board exams. It is an absolutely magnificent achievement, but a new guy/girl does it every year. And while many (though definitely not all) of them will have successful fruitful careers, extremely few of those toppers will go on to become the CEO of a large MNC (which is what an olympic medal is). Can we still hit double digits in 2024 ?? Absolutely. But we may even end up like Rio. Its just too far away to pass judgement. Either way, I wud much rather look to senior results for indicators than junior results. And if we are lucky and these next two years go really well, and with Tokyo being very hot during August, I am hoping for at least 6-8 medals in Tokyo itself. Lot will depend on shooting though.

It is actually very annoying for many of us Indians as well. The thing is that a large number of our wrestlers and boxers come from the state of Haryana. Now I am no expert in the subject, and somebody can correct me if I am wrong, but from what I understand, many people in Haryana believe in never ever using your surname with your name because your surname identifies your caste. There has been some unfortunate caste-based violence in the past in Haryana and, as a result, many believe that the best way to avoid it is to just never ever reveal your caste as it doesn't matter. In fact, I think some of the big boxing and wrestling stables in Haryana actually have a rule that you are not allowed to use your surname.

Completely agreed. Junior achievements always need to be taken with a grain of salt. We in India tend to go overboard with them.

Hope you are right but I'll believe the hype when I see performance at the senior level. Just looking at the numbers provided by you, it seems to me that the only real gain has been shooting. And shooting is a gain no doubt - as a country we have definitely improved from where we were in 2014. But I at least am hoping to see those gains in 2020 itself as opposed to 2024. Still - I personally dont believe in the methodology of counting junior medals at all. Fact is, in today's sporting landscape, youngsters across the world are maturing faster. The best juniors are already competing in the seniors and most of them stop competing in juniors once they graduate to seniors (like our own Sania had done when she was 16). Indian juniors however keep competing in junior events even after having already made a significant mark at the senior level (like Manu, Mehuli, Saurabh etc) as even those wins are starting to make them stars. Then of course there is always the huge issue of age-fudging. Also, by nature, junior athletes are essentially competing against a field of athletes born in a 2-yr period which is small competition as compared to seniors. Also, if some sort of analysis is done, I would venture a guess that it would be found that 18-yr olds winning an U18 world title rarely make it to the absolute elite level in seniors (because the title is often won with the best 18-yr olds absent and already competing in the seniors). However, a 15-16 yr old winning an U18 title wud have a much better chance.