And regarding ban with all other unsportmanlike reasons, it's just so shortsighted because it will only increase anti western sentiment among ordinary Russians which have nothing to do with war. It's just opposite of something that you want to accomplish.
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The only thing - regarding to all of this ban staff - is that we must never forget that it was Slovenia, Bosnia and Croatia who invaded Serbia back in the 90s, it was Kosovo who invaded Serbia after that and it was Ukraine who invaded Russia in 2022, all of them to gain their people and their territory.
Apart from that, I 100% agree that this is sports website so I will try to avoid political stuff in the future.
You did a good job to get to the core of the problem. Bosnia and Croatia had a significant Serb population that didn't want to live in their new secessionist states just as Russians in Donetsk, Crimea and Lugansk didn't want to live in a new post 2014 coup Ukraine. Yet, all those countries have had a right to secession, just as Kosovo, but Russians in DNR, LNR and Crimea don't have that right. Kosovo is even bigger example of this nonsense because it never was independent country. Talking about double standards.
ExpandIf i have seen NATO bombs falling on my head, i would probably share your point if view.
the thing is majority of Polish people in my generation haven’t done or supported anything what could make anyone think about throwing bombs on their heads
sorry, but after Sarajevo and Srebrenica we will not find common stand here
and obviously i know when NATO bombings in Serbia happened, but I wonder if they happened earlier the war in Bośnia would be shorter and less cruel or not???
Well, I really don't want to get too much political on a sports thread, but NATO bombing wasn't related to Bosnia war at all. And I don't see what Sarajevo and Srebrenica have to do with anything, but ok, put it out there for no reason at all. I could respond with all crimes committed by other sides in those wars and we could "talk" like that for decades. But you haven't experienced war and I hope you never do. And when bombs fell on Serbia and killed ordinary people majority of Serbian people surely didn't think how to ban NATO countries athletes to compete anywhere. Sportsmanlike is you want to beat them, not to ban people who have nothing to do with war.
ExpandSo the IOC argument is that because there are no UN sanctions against Russia or Belarus, they should be free to compete but conveniently ignores the fact that the only reason there are no UN sanctions in place is because Russia is blocking them.
Putting out rubbish like this really just undermines their credibility.
This is what happens when you live in your small echo chamber. China doesn't support sanctions, India doesn't support sanctions. Actually, much bigger part of the planet regarding both population and pure size don't sanction Russia. But, this is what's so typical for NATO countries, they all think that their opinion is only relevant and that they represent the entire world.
ExpandImagine how unsportsmanlike it is to violate the Olympic Truce on the heels of getting a slap on the wrist for running a state-sponsored doping program during the Olympics you hosted…
Imagine beleiving Olympic Truce is a thing.
ExpandYou can't separate politics and sport at the time of such a major military conflict. If you think that this is comparable to the Korean War or the Vietnam War, or any other war since WW2 you are fooling yourself. It's the largest attempted landgrab in Europe since Hitler was defeated, the historical significance of such an event is massive and can't be brushed aside as just yet another war. Making a "safe space" out of the Olympics would be foolish.
And yes, every Russian athlete, every Russian citizen is culpable. I say this as a Hungarian who knows that the fact that I am living in Hungary supports Orbán's system, regardless of how much I hate him. Russia is exactly like Hungary, just on steroids. They are all guilty, just like I will be guilty of being part of Orbán's regime if he does something truly awful, no matter how many times I vote against him. Putin isn't doing this alone. If Russia is like Hungary, the country is rotten to its core. People need to take responsibility for the actions of their nation if they live there and they are part of its society. Putin would have never started this war if the Russian society wouldn't accept such an action.
Give me a break.
Edited by SindoExpandTranslation
Chairman of the Latvian Olympic Committee Georges Tikmers said that Latvia would not go to the Olympic Games if athletes from Russia and Belarus were allowed to participate in them.
“The position of Latvia is that if these Olympic Games were held now and it was expected that athletes from Russia and Belarus would take part in them, I think that the Latvian team would not go to these Games,” Tikmers said on the air of Latvian television.
What a loss for world sports community.
But jokes aside, just imagine how much unsportsmanlike is to wish that other athletes don't compete. I mean it's just insane.
Response rates are terrible and are falling down with every year. Biggest issue for pollsters is how to reach representative sample in this day and age..
ExpandThis misconception is just so annoying. The 2016 national polls underestimated Trump less than the 2012 polls underestimated Obama, or that the French polls in 2017 underestimated Macron. How good or bad polls are is very state dependent, too. Ohio and Michigan polls have been sort of garbage recently, compared to polls of say Georgia that have consistently been spot-on.
Misconseption about misconseption is also annoying. Polls were very wrong in 2016 and 2020. Especially state polls and state polls matter the most. There were polls which didn't show Trump lead once and Democrats up by 15pts or so. But hey misconception. There were states where they even didn't show Trump in single digits and he won. So, I'm very well aware of the situation and error was very big.
I would take those numbers with a huge chunk of salt. Their polls can't predict presidential race in US even though they poll it million times, now I'm suppose to beleive they nailed summer olympic sports...
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I think everybody's well aware about the doping problem in Kenya. It is questionable whether it its state-sponsored (authorities help athletes to get their drugs) or if they just look away, but whatever. The point is that there is simply not that clear evidence about a systematical doping as we have in the Russian case. Should we wait with punishment for a proven state-sponsored doping fraud until we have checked all other countries? If two burglars rob a bank and we have evidence for only one of them - should both be released just because it would be unfair to the burglar in prison?
And moreover, I really don't see why you make an East-Western thing of it. There is no country in the world which has a better network in world sports than Russia. You really think they let Kenya go on purpose while they punish Russia? That's hilarious in my eyes.
Because it's political and everybody knows it.
Watching Sweden - RSA, than probably second half of Brazil match, and on the night probably USA, but I'm tired, don't know how much will I endure
If they ban the NOC, no way they go under the olympic flag, Putin will not allow it.
ExpandAre all American and British athletes clean. The answer is no, but in the case of GB - I can't speak for the US - the BOC has always taken a hardline against drug cheats and, until forced to overturn the rule by WADA, they banned them for life. Denmark was the only other country to take a similar line. If any British athlete has used drugs in order to enhance their performance then I hope they will be exposed by the testers in Rio.
As has been mentioned elsewhere there is a world of difference between state sponsored doping on a mass scale as occurred in the old East Germany and now appears to be the case in Russia, and individual coaches and athletes using drugs to cheat the competition in countries like the US. Both are unacceptable but clearly the former is much more serious simply because of the breadth of it and the collusion of various organs of the state.
I'm sorry to see that much of the debate has been political rather than considering the effect of doping/cheating on the athletes. Firstly, those who are being cheated out of medals and the financial benefits that may go with them, but equally those Russian athletes who have been placed under pressure to take drugs in order to pursue a political agenda and by doing so are placing their health at risk.
Will Russia be banned from Rio? My guess is yes or the IOC and the Olympic Games will have no credibility left. If Russia was present each time her athletes won a medal there would be a huge cloud over both them and the event. Will there be drug cheats present in Rio? Undoubtedly, and we can only hope that they are caught no matter which country they originate from and exposed to the ridicule and punishment they fully deserve. I for one am sick of having to see proven drug cheats like Gatlin and Efimova lining up at major championships and favour lifetime bans.
I always get that response that of course not all British and Americans are clean but there isn't no state sponsored doping. And I'm failing to see ANY of high profile athletes
from these countries getting bans. Are they just more sophisticated or there is something else to it?
ExpandMy point about this is that it's a) easier to believe and b) more logical that countries where "glory to the Motherland" (or some communist stuff) through sports is so incredibly important, are doping with state help.
For example here in the Netherlands we don't have this extreme "glory to the Motherland" feeling and I don't think there is state-run doping here. Obviously I think there is doping here, but I think it's more private or arranged by the teams itself instead of coming from the sports federations and authorities.
But my main point stays the same: it is a sign of huge weakness when people are saying "Stop it, it's a conspiracy from the big bad wolf against us!" instead of "We're gonna do all we can to clean up this shit".
1. XX athletes from country X get caught
2. People in country X respond by saying "omg, conspiracy against us, we're the victims!!"
That doesn't make it any more believable.
But it makes it believable when there are no other countries involved.
And again your first sentence is biased because there isn't anything logical that thoce countries would dope more than other countries. Only propaganda.
ExpandMostly because those are quite well known as oppressing regimes where saying "the Great Leader is maybe not the best thing that happened to our Great Nation ever" gets you in jail as a matter of speak. And yes, I find freedom-hating regimes harder to believe (I mean, look at East-Germany, not exactly a free country back in the time and they had some serious doping going on..."bring joy to the Motherland" at all costs).
You just made my point for me. This is politics speaking. Talking about freedom hating regimes and other nonsense. East Germany is history. I mean we could talk politics, maybe not on this thread, talking about racial, gender or income inequality or healthcare in the USA but it's not the point. It's a bias. And when we are talking doping you do believe that all these others are doping as well but we are not seeing them being punished so that's the reason for "conspiracy" stories.
ExpandTrust me, there is no way I believe the Dutch skaters in general are clean
But thinking that this whole thing about the Russian state doping is actually a Western conspiracy..nah, no way. Maybe it is easy to make people believe that countries like Russia, China and North Korea are massively doping, but I really don't think this is such a weird thought.
Instead of screaming "OMG it's a conspiracy!" like a frustrated teenage child, it'd be a lot more helpful to take the blame and start cleaning up the mess for real.
But why only those states? This is key issue here. I don't think there is conspiracy about state Russian doping but I am pretty sure there is a conspiracy to target only Russian state doping. There's big difference. I don't deny doping from Russians, obviously it exists but I don't beleive that only Russians are big bad wolf in that sense. I mean you are mentioning Russia, China and N. Korea. Why? Because regimes in these countries aren't carrying water for the US regime.. It's politics.
Just curious when will Americans be under investigation?
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By Biathlonfan · Posted
Mykolas Alekna opens his season up at the brutus hamilton invitational,it's his last season of college athletics and he opened with 70.09 which is of course the world lead [gustavseeons over 70 mark was not recognized by world athletics,that's official now] he also had throws of 70.01,68.86,68.73,67.68 and he opened with 65.85. his longest throw looked extreamly casual,the man did not look like he was even trying . -
Will they have time for that when the mixed doubles already starts before the opening ceremony? or is it time that curling maybe changes to 2 groups of 6 instegs for tre round robin ? -
Time for the IOC to consider moving the curling fields to 12 teams, in line with pretty much every other team sport on either the summer/winter program. -
It probably meant to happen next year but i don't agree as to results. Head is important, sth went wrong there and even when they knew it's over they started to look better in Planica. I believe it will get better and if he stays at junior level no, it ain't gonna be cheaper at all. Rather the other way round. Even if his salary will be a bit smaller his level will force bigger investments in youth squad. So this theory is like 50/50 now (i admit i didn't expect this junior version but it seems realistic now). -
The drought continues, it’s been almost two weeks since last won a curling world championship -
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Big congrats to for finally qualifying for the Olympics in men’s curling after *so* many close calls. The OQT is gonna be brutal on both the men’s and women’s side :O
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Posted
Not too many I suppose. Maybe the ususal suspects Baltic states.
I would think that as Ukraine being invaded and in a state of war, Ukrainian parliament would find something smarter to work on rather than this, but who am I to judge.
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