[OFF TOPIC] Politics Thread

[Olympian1010 8,073]

  On 9/11/2019 at 1:20 AM, Майкл said:

I just remembered that Gore had an idea to run for president too... AGAIN  Someone probably advised him not to embarrass himself again haha

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Well he “won” that election. It’s because of the fucking electoral college that the right candidates have lost elections. We’ve given to much power to Iowa, Ohio, Florida, and New Hampshire. The minute we get rid of the electoral college will be the end of classic American conservatism. It’s a day I wait for eagerly. If the DNC loses this election it’s on them. I really don’t understand voting for Trump unless you’re a racist, sexist, or otherwise deplorable person. 

[Olympian1010 8,073]

Also something to look for, but not really in the 2020 election if Trump wins is Calexit. After the 2016 election California independence was polling at 35%-40% favorability among Californians. If Trump wins there’s a small chance California becomes the first state to vote on leaving union since the civil war. It’s a bill I’ve already signed the petition supporting.

Edited September 11, 2019 by Olympian1010

[Майкл 561]

  On 9/11/2019 at 1:34 AM, Olympian1010 said:

Well he “won” that election. It’s because of the fucking electoral college that the right candidates have lost elections. We’ve given to much power to Iowa, Ohio, Florida, and New Hampshire. The minute we get rid of the electoral college will be the end of classic American conservatism. It’s a day I wait for eagerly. If the DNC loses this election it’s on them. I really don’t understand voting for Trump unless you’re a racist, sexist, or otherwise deplorable person. 

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Florida always fucks up the results, doesn't it? 

 

On a serious note - Trump turned out to be a very talented politician, luckily for the States he hadn't realised that earlier.

 

1) He's charismatic and a great leader;

2) He understands how social media work so well;

3) Most importantly, he can get under the skin of white plebs so easily thanks to his awareness of all shortcomings of American society... he exploits their inner insecurities and prejudicies and eventually makes them vote for him, making them believe that he is THE MAN that will solve their problems (amazing, right?).

 

But, in the end, he still makes a lot of mistakes as a statesman. Mainly because he's never realised that one cannot lead a country the same way he runs the corporation.

[Olympian1010 8,073]

  On 9/11/2019 at 2:02 AM, Майкл said:

 

Florida always fucks up the results, doesn't it? 

 

On a serious note - Trump turned out to be a very talented politician, luckily for the States he hadn't realised that earlier.

 

1) He's charismatic and a great leader;

2) He understands how social media work so well;

3) Most importantly, he can get under the skin of white plebs so easily thanks to his awareness of all shortcomings of American society... he exploits their inner insecurities and prejudicies and eventually makes them vote for him, making them believe that he is THE MAN that will solve their problems (amazing, right?).

 

But, in the end, he still makes a lot of mistakes as a statesman. Mainly because he's never realised that one cannot lead a country the same way he runs the corporation.

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Plus, it’s hard to run a country with the temper of a 2 year old . He wasn’t huge on social media by the way. It was more than he did well on TV and made a name for himself. Democratic candidates have been much better at running social media campaigns with the exception of Hilary.

[heywoodu 15,353]

  On 9/11/2019 at 12:46 AM, Olympian1010 said:

The fact that white male candidates are the only ones with huge majorities against Trump is just embarrassing. It also shows that the GOP may not be the only ones with gender/race issues...

 

I’d prefer Sanders over Biden. I prefer Harris, Warren, or Castro over Sanders. At least Sanders matches me politically. Plus, the election hasn’t gotten too ugly yet, so that’s positive. Definitely looking forward to the first single night debate.

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Buttigieg is a white male, would it be sufficient for you if he managed to get a majority in terms of 'diversity needs to go above capability'?

 

Which is how it often sounds when people complain about there being too many white males....perhaps, just perhaps, these specific white males are a better choice for most people than these specific non-white non-males. Maybe they're not, but white males getting a majority doesn't by definition mean there is a significant race/gender issue, just like the opposite doesn't mean there's not.

 

About my own preference: I really don't know, kinda hoping for Buttigieg. For USA's overall image I just hope it won't be 'old man yells at cloud' grandpa Sanders.

[heywoodu 15,353]

  On 9/11/2019 at 1:34 AM, Olympian1010 said:

 I really don’t understand voting for Trump unless you’re a racist, sexist, or otherwise deplorable person. 

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Wow, say hello to the kind of language you generally see from a lot of Trump voters. "They disagree with me, so they must be shitty people." 

[Olympian1010 8,073]

  On 9/11/2019 at 6:58 AM, heywoodu said:

Buttigieg is a white male, would it be sufficient for you if he managed to get a majority in terms of 'diversity needs to go above capability'?

 

Which is how it often sounds when people complain about there being too many white males....perhaps, just perhaps, these specific white males are a better choice for most people than these specific non-white non-males. Maybe they're not, but white males getting a majority doesn't by definition mean there is a significant race/gender issue, just like the opposite doesn't mean there's not.

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Not really because Buttigieg (cheers for being able to spell that) has a failed record of letting his city’s police department get away with brutality. That said, he has tried repeatedly to make for in, and has really improved the economic situation of South Bend. I think economics is the social science of the rich, so that doesn’t really do much for, but I do does move a lot of potential voters. It would be cool to see America elect its first openly gay president, but I don’t think he’s the right choice. 

 

You raise a fair point about white male candidates being “more qualified”. However, it’s easier to make it in this country as a white male. I use my privilege constantly and it kills me. I don’t have to jump through the same hoops as the blacks students in my classes. I don’t get labeled as a robbery suspect because of my skin color. People don’t deny their services to me because of my religion or sexual orientation. So, yeah race matters. When powerful women like Kamala and Harris make complaints against Trump for instance, it’s often labeled negatively because of their tone, or because they don’t dress “respectfully”, or “hold their tongue” on the matter, or “make up lies to deceive voters”. Kamala is probably the most qualified candidate in the debate. Warren has been around for the last half century and has unmatched wisdom (maybe Sanders or Biden could match her). It will always be an issue of race, religion, sexual orientation, gender in this country because the thing Americans fear the most is change. We’re to god damn lazy to look a problem head on and fix it. The Democratic Party often likes to act like we live in a post-racial and post-sex society and that’s just wrong. The Civil Rights Movement wasn’t supposed to be the see all end all of fixing this countries race issues. The Women’s March didn’t free woman from the burden of gender disparity. And the fact that Trump might be relected only shows what a lost cause this country is. 

 

I don’t blame you or hate you for your views. I just think they might not be the most accurate coming from one of the whitest countries on the planet.

[Olympian1010 8,073]

  On 9/11/2019 at 7:01 AM, heywoodu said:

 

Wow, say hello to the kind of language you generally see from a lot of Trump voters. "They disagree with me, so they must be shitty people." 

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Well I’m am by all means a shity person, so they’re not wrong. The difference is that I try with all my little power to fix what I have done. I try to with my writings, my poems, my political theory, my wit, and my vote to make this country a better place for everyone. So I am a shity person, but at least I’m willing to clean my shit stain of the rug.

[heywoodu 15,353]

  On 9/11/2019 at 7:30 AM, Olympian1010 said:

Not really because Buttigieg (cheers for being able to spell that) has a failed record of letting his city’s police department get away with brutality. That said, he has tried repeatedly to make for in, and has really improved the economic situation of South Bend. I think economics is the social science of the rich, so that doesn’t really do much for, but I do does move a lot of potential voters. It would be cool to see America elect its first openly gay president, but I don’t think he’s the right choice. 

 

You raise a fair point about white male candidates being “more qualified”. However, it’s easier to make it in this country as a white male. I use my privilege constantly and it kills me. I don’t have to jump through the same hoops as the blacks students in my classes. I don’t get labeled as a robbery suspect because of my skin color. People don’t deny their services to me because of my religion or sexual orientation. So, yeah race matters. When powerful women like Kamala and Harris make complaints against Trump for instance, it’s often labeled negatively because of their tone, or because they don’t dress “respectfully”, or “hold their tongue” on the matter, or “make up lies to deceive voters”. Kamala is probably the most qualified candidate in the debate. Warren has been around for the last half century and has unmatched wisdom (maybe Sanders or Biden could match her). It will always be an issue of race, religion, sexual orientation, gender in this country because the thing Americans fear the most is change. We’re to god damn lazy to look a problem head on and fix it. The Democratic Party often likes to act like we live in a post-racial and post-sex society and that’s just wrong. The Civil Rights Movement wasn’t supposed to be the see all end all of fixing this countries race issues. The Women’s March didn’t free woman from the burden of gender disparity. And the fact that Trump might be relected only shows what a lost cause this country is. 

 

I don’t blame you or hate you for your views. I just think they might not be the most accurate coming from one of the whitest countries on the planet.

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I have no doubt it is generally easier to make it as a white male, at least in Western society, that's not my point, at all. My point is: no matter how hard or easy it is to get somewhere, the position - especially that of president - should always, without any doubt, go to the person one considers most qualified. If that's a black woman, perfectly fine, choose her. If that's non-binary mixed Asian-Arab-Native American-Caucasian-Latin panfluidsexual transgender, just as fine, choose this person. If that's an older white male, just as fine, choose him.

 

As long as people don't go about voting based on what someone's religion, sexual orientation or skin colour is, both in a negative way (which I know happens a lot) or in a 'positive' way (because it's not a positive thing to get elected mostly because of anything but your political actions).

[Olympian1010 8,073]

  On 9/11/2019 at 7:40 AM, heywoodu said:

 (because it's not a positive thing to get elected mostly because of anything but your political actions).

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Trump’s presidency in a nutshell right there.

 

I agree with what you said, but the problem is that white voters tend to only see white male candidates as qualified. I’m sorry but Biden and Buttigieg do not have the cleanest records. Neither does Kamala or Warren, but it in terms of the what this country needs they’re better choices. We’ve tried white males for 300 years and this country has gotten marginally better. All I’m saying is that it’d be nice if our legacy wasn’t so white.

 

I don’t have anything against a white male, I just think it’s time to try something different. All the candidates left in this race our qualified, so why not go for a candidate that’s a true reflection of our country.