[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 11:16 PM, OlympicsFan said:

Obviously there is no proof, otherwise he wouldn't be allowed to compete. Common sense/a basic understanding of statistics should tell you that the probablity of him being clean at best is as big as the probability of you winning the lottery every week for the rest of your live.

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If Germany had a similar swimmer or athlete would the German press be outright suspicious without any even circumstantial evidence other than data. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 11:12 PM, OlympicsFan said:

I don't think so, german people are far less nationalistic than british/american people. I didn't really notice any hype. The biggest topics were actually Patrick Moster (the guy who used a racist slur towards riders from North Africa) and Annika Schleu + her coach for the way they treated her horse. From a sporting perspective the biggest story probably was the gold for Alexander Zverev.

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That is starting to change through- the shadow of WW2 is not going to blunt nationalism for evermore.  

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:45 PM, OlympicsFan said:

German athletics gets more money than british athletics. German athletics has the same problem as many other fields in Germany. It is lead by people who are too naive and actually think that you can compete without doping. I guess in a nation that is lead by a person who thinks that she can convince Putin/Erdogan/Orban to change their course by asking them nicely this isn't too surprising ...

I think the last two olympic champions in a track event were Dieter Baumann (got caught) and Nils Schumann (strong suspicions) ... and i don't believe that this was a coincidence. Germany chose to not use the GDR know-how anymore and instead those coaches went abroad ... and for example took over british rowing.

 

France has a different "problem", unlike GB and Germany they are actually relevant in team sports. Imagine how good France could be in sprinting, if they could use all their volleyball/handball/basketball talent there ...

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I wonder if the German public will eventually demand to see improvements in Olympic performance. They certainly seemed a lot of hype for the golds won. 
 

 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:38 PM, OlympicsFan said:

Of course they do, only the other doping super powers (Jamaica, Kenya, Ethiopia, USA) win more track medals. Germany for example hasn't won a single track medal at the olympics since 2000! Klosterhalfen is as much part of the german system as Farah was/is. A lot of german journalists raised questions after she decided to join Salazar. Until recently my view was that anyone who wins a track medal at world level is dirty (regardless of nationality), but now i think that it might be possible to win a medal in the hurdles/steeplechase without doping. Klosterhalfen won a medal in the 5000 m, so there you have your answer ...

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Why the stepplechase ? That seems to be full of runners testing positive. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:38 PM, Monzanator said:

Obviously cycling is the most doped sport outside of weightlifting but IOC seems to be fine with it for whatever reason. Plus Sky/Ineos is the best funded team in sport so they have more money for "jiffy bags" than others. Let's see if Geoghegan Hart becomes the next Wiggins/Froome.

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Surely UAE team are even richer being they state funded by an oil rich state. And Arab nations like to get sporting success by spend spend spend. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:32 PM, OlympicsFan said:

It is shocking how you can get almost everything wrong in such a short comment ...

 

1) Klosterhalfen turned 24 this year and won a world championship bronze less than two years ago. She also just finished 8th at the olympics, which made her the best european runner in this event. What was the best finish of a polish woman in a track event?

2) So you are saying Germany isn't relevant in women's javelin (number 2 in the world this year), women's discus throw (olympic silver medalist) and men's decathlon (defending world champion who turns 23 this year and 99 % would have won at least bronze at the olympics without the injury). I believe that Germany had more top 8 finishes at the olympics than the Netherlands/Italy and as many as Poland (thanks to their gold in the joke mixed relay). Those countries had generational fluke performances, but their actual level in athletics is much lower than the medals make it seem.

3) You are correct that Germany got much worse in doping sports over the last decades. Not too long ago Germany was still great in speed skating, rowing, biathlon, (men's) cross-country and women's canoeing sprint. 

 

I wish you were trolling, but sadly i don't think you are.

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As a single Olympic final level  rower from outside of Russia tested positive in the last five years?

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:32 PM, OlympicsFan said:

It is shocking how you can get almost everything wrong in such a short comment ...

 

1) Klosterhalfen turned 24 this year and won a world championship bronze less than two years ago. She also just finished 8th at the olympics, which made her the best european runner in this event. What was the best finish of a polish woman in a track event?

2) So you are saying Germany isn't relevant in women's javelin (number 2 in the world this year), women's discus throw (olympic silver medalist) and men's decathlon (defending world champion who turns 23 this year and 99 % would have won at least bronze at the olympics without the injury). I believe that Germany had more top 8 finishes at the olympics than the Netherlands/Italy and as many as Poland (thanks to their gold in the joke mixed relay). Those countries had generational fluke performances, but their actual level in athletics is much lower than the medals make it seem.

3) You are correct that Germany got much worse in doping sports over the last decades. Not too long ago Germany was still great in speed skating, rowing, biathlon, (men's) cross-country and women's canoeing sprint. 

 

I wish you were trolling, but sadly i don't think you are.

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Do you’d think she is clean then. She worked with Salazar and everyone else who has worked with him like Farrah and Hasan are seen as deeply suspect, 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:28 PM, Monzanator said:

Thankfully not many cycling fans seem to support Team Sky/Ineos evil empire. Their "jiffy bags" are suspicious as hell indeed.

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True but Surely every team in cycling is suspect. 

Ineos are not popular in the UK anymore at all - the main elite sporting press hate them (and the tabloid readers don’t like cyclists full stop)

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:24 PM, OlympicsFan said:

Yes, espcially swimming ... also we ignore the miracle rise of british cycling because ... ? I feel sorry for you if you actually think that GB achieved this ridiculous improvement without systematic doping.

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GB rise in swimming is not notably massive in the grand scale of things.

 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:23 PM, Monzanator said:

Klosterhalfen is literally irrelevant on the grand scheme of things. Germany has completely tailed off in athletics, 400m and middle distance running is gone and most field events have sunked too. Only javelin remains at relatively good level. Discus, shot and hammer are nowhere. If we assume the DDR doping system was behind the sprinting success, Germany still competed at solid international level for the next 20 years. And now they have Mihambo, men's javelin and nothing else.

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Funding must be at least partly to blame. France has suffered a similar fate. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:22 PM, OlympicsFan said:

No, she isn't. She planned to move to his training group, but couldn't do it thanks to COVID. Please inform yourself in the future before accusing everybody who isn't british.

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So she was still tempted then - does she plain to do so once Covid has passed ?

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 9:52 PM, OlympicsFan said:

Obviously Ujah being doped was expected, but i am extremely surprised that british coaches allowed him to get caught (that easily). Usually GB is extremely good at not getting caught. When was the last time that a british athlete at this level got caught? Ohuruogu? Extremely impressive streak for a nation that usually wins a lot of track medals. Will be interesting to see if he actually gets a ban and not just a slap on the wrist.

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The UK doesn’t win that many track medals. And 

 

What’s your view on Konstanze Klosterhalfen ?

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 9:59 PM, OlympicsFan said:

Maybe they should take a serious look at british sports and how it went from irrelevant to top 3 within a decade ... or british cycling ... or Paula Radcliffe ... or Mo Farah. British people are the last that should point fingers when it comes to doping.

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The British press are not exactly noted for not reporting on Farah or Radcliffe. The main documentary in Salazar was produced by the BBC.

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 10:03 PM, Mkbw50 said:

Lottery funding

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And other than cycling most of the increase is in a select few sports when funding and full time training is proven to make a lot of the difference and doping is not likely to be effective. 

[Orangehair43 258]

I suspect UKAD are happy as this is the type of story needed to help push criminalisation of doping up the political agenda. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 9:12 PM, Monzanator said:

 

Does US TV - ESPN or whatever - actually show much athletics anyway? These European meetings ain't held in US prime time so Idk if athletics ever gets a big spot on US TV these days?

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Johnson doesn’t really do the diamond league anymore for the BBC anyway. He tends to only appear for the Olympics and Worlds now a days. 
 

 

And with BBC cutbacks he might not do the World’s next year as I doubt the BBC will fly all the presenting staff and crew out to Eugene and will he really want to be in Manchester talking about action hosted in America. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 8:35 PM, George_D said:

no problem if it is the same for all countries. Clean games for all in all sports

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Would they be any countries left? 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 8:25 PM, Monzanator said:

BALCO scandal unearthed the facts that USA is as dirty as East Germany & co. And federal law was immune to Nike & Big Tech money plus Marion Jones lied to the FBI. It was a spectacular collapse in the end. It's no wonder Carl Lewis keeps it relatively low-key these days, he knows he got away with major doping issues and USTF knows that too. It's better to keep him in the basement while Michael Johnson remains the most visible former US athlete out there.

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Is he that low key ? Even Michael Johnson is only on British TV.

 

 

Mihambo is working with him which is suspicious as well. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 8:03 PM, George_D said:

agreed. Let the rules be for every/as many country/ies

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Mine and your countries would be banned for sure. Christie and Chambers for GB and numerous for Greece. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 7:57 PM, George_D said:

 

So IOC should ban USA and IAAF from Olympics

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Front that era every country was guilty. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 7:46 PM, Dunadan said:

Indeed, that was the 2nd funniest moment of these Games- a Brit getting caught immediately after Brits complained that they had been beaten by someone who would surely be caught within days.

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I actually do wonder if his defence will end up being he was set up because he is a Brit. 
 

 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 7:27 PM, Monzanator said:

 

Carl Lewis failed three doping tests during 1988 US Olympic Trials. He admitted it back in 2003 already. It's common knowledge he was a cheater too.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/sport/2003/apr/24/athletics.duncanmackay

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Yet the BBC were going heavy on him tweeting about the USA relay flop. Michal Johnson did not look happy and admitted him and Carl Lewis very rarely agree. 
 

The rumour has always been that it might have went higher and they were threats to boycott Seoul if Americans got caught and exposed. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 6:54 PM, Dunadan said:

"Are you hurt?" "But who gives a fuck now"...I think anyone who watched videos made from the stands of the first words between his coach and Jacobs after the 4x100 knew he was going to be out for a while.

 

He might be doping but he's not the one who tested positive so far  British journalists have to prove it instead of making vague references Ryan Murphy-style

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I wonder if Jacobs has been poorly advised and should have gone all out with saying how he is injured. It could help his reputation even more in Italy as him getting injured while taking his country to gold would be forever remembered. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 6:35 PM, De_Gambassi said:

And they shouldn't. It's so fucking obvious...

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To not run the rest of the season makes me think he knows he won’t be caught back home and would be protected by some form of corrupt national doping agency. Athletes times don’t normally drop that quickly if he didn’t actually dope for the rest of the year. 

[Orangehair43 258]

  On 8/12/2021 at 6:28 PM, George_D said:

Florence Griffith Joyner was clean for sure.. 😁 

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That entire USA team were probably all doping. The other two big names well Jackie was related to her and Carl has been accused many times.