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thiago_simoes

Artistic Gymnastics 2018 Discussion Thread

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Since the YOG topic is too crowded, I'll post it here both as a reminder to myself and as a way to keep people informed.

Iran and Ireland reached for the first time ever the finals in artistic gymnastics at an Olympic event. Iran on men's pommel horse, Ireland on women's vault.

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Dutch women's team for the world champs: Sanne Wevers, Vera van Pol, Kirsten Polderman, Sanna Veerman, Naomi Visser and Tisha Volleman.

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More history in the making: at the 2018 YOG, Vietnam also reached the finals for the first time ever at an Olympic event. 

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This is HUGE news for gymnastics: the girl from Costa Rica qualified to the all-around final in artistic gymnastics.

This is especially surprising because she did not qualify to the YOG "normally" -- she was the first reserve, and two weeks ago she was officially announced as a qualifier because the US gave up their quota. And now she will be in an Olympic final. AMAZING!

 

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Now that the YOG are over, I want to comment about the team event.

It was terrible.

I mean, it's a good idea to have a team event, but the fact that gymnasts were randomly assigned to teams made things unfair. For example, first and second place in qualifications in rhythmic gymnastics were occupied by Russia and Italy, and then both gymnasts ended up together in the same team (Team Simone Biles). The leader (and gold medal winner) in women's trampoline and the eventual gold medalists in acrobatic gymnastics were also part of the team. The problem is: the team also had one male artistic gymnast from South Africa who finished 33rd among 34 gymnasts. It also had one female artistic gymnast from Singapore who finished 27th out of 32 gymnasts. And, yes, they were awarded gold with the team.

 

Teams should have been smaller, and gymnasts should have been given the choice to add who they wanted to their teams. At the very least, they should have created teams based on continents (North America, Europe 1, South America, Africa and so on) in order to guarantee everybody was on the same level. While it's great for South Africa and Singapore to have a gymnast who is now an Olympic medalist in gymnastics, I ask myself if they really deserved to be there.

 

Now, not everything was problematic, though. The mixed pairs in acrobatics from Portugal and Belarus earned team medals. So did Adam Tobin from Great Britain and Robert Vilarasau of Spain. None of them won medals when competing alone, and they did all great, so they deserved a medal and they got it through the team event. The problem is that a bunch of people who did not deserve medals also earned them.

 

 

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Just now, thiago_simoes said:

Now that the YOG are over, I want to comment about the team event.

It was terrible.

I mean, it's a good idea to have a team event, but the fact that gymnasts were randomly assigned to teams made things unfair. For example, first and second place in qualifications in rhythmic gymnastics were occupied by Russia and Italy, and then both gymnasts ended up together in the same team (Team Simone Biles). The leader (and gold medal winner) in women's trampoline and the eventual gold medalists in acrobatic gymnastics were also part of the team. The problem is: the team also had one male artistic gymnast from South Africa who finished 33rd among 34 gymnasts. It also had one female artistic gymnast from Singapore who finished 27th out of 32 gymnasts. And, yes, they were awarded gold with the team.

 

Teams should have been smaller, and gymnasts should have been given the choice to add who they wanted to their teams. At the very least, they should have created teams based on continents (North America, Europe 1, South America, Africa and so on) in order to guarantee everybody was on the same level. While it's great for South Africa and Singapore to have a gymnast who is now an Olympic medalist in gymnastics, I ask myself if they really deserved to be there.

 

Now, not everything was problematic, though. The mixed pairs in acrobatics from Portugal and Belarus earned team medals. So did Adam Tobin from Great Britain and Robert Vilarasau of Spain. None of them won medals when competing alone, and they did all great, so they deserved a medal and they got it through the team event. The problem is that a bunch of people who did not deserve medals also earned them.

 

 

Well, that's the thing with mixed nation mixed team events at the Youth Olympics. Same thing with speed skating at the winter version for example, where medals were won by athletes who individually would never be anywhere close to a medal, because they were in a team with some of the best individual skaters. I'm guessing the same thing happened in table tennis, badminton and so on.

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Agora, heywoodu disse:

Well, that's the thing with mixed nation mixed team events at the Youth Olympics. Same thing with speed skating at the winter version for example, where medals were won by athletes who individually would never be anywhere close to a medal, because they were in a team with some of the best individual skaters. I'm guessing the same thing happened in table tennis, badminton and so on.


In badminton, yes, but not in table tennis. Since the mixed team in table tennis is actually a pair, both of them have to be pretty good in order to advance. Only once a questionable player got a medal: a guy from Tunisia in 2010 because he was paired with the Chinese girl, but I still consider him to be a decent player. In smaller teams there's practically no way a low level athlete would earn a medal. But in big teams (6 to 13 people) it's very likely that a bad athlete will eventually win a medal somehow.

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Just now, thiago_simoes said:

In badminton, yes, but not in table tennis. Since the mixed team in table tennis is actually a pair, both of them have to be pretty good in order to advance. Only once a questionable player got a medal: a guy from Tunisia in 2010 because he was paired with the Chinese girl, but I still consider him to be a decent player. In smaller teams there's practically no way a low level athlete would earn a medal. But in big teams (6 to 13 people) it's very likely that a bad athlete will eventually win a medal somehow.

Right, I forget it's pairs in table tennis. Still, I'm sure there are other sports with a similar mixed team format. I think one might see it more as a sort of 'friendly' competition (and possibly an opportunity for 'minor athletes' to learn from the big guys and girls) and we - as big sports fans - shouldn't see them as anything too serious. Only Thomas Bach would introduce himself as a Youth Olympics mixed team champion.

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We've had so many "firsts" in gymnastics this year! Let me review some of them:

World Championships
Acrobatic gymnastics - first gold medal for :ISR
Aerobic gymnastics - first medal for :UKR
Artistic gymnastics - first medal for :PHI, first women's medal for :MEX, first gold medal for :BEL

Trampoline - first medal for :MEX, first gold medal for :SWE
 

Youth Olympics

First world medal in gymnastics for :IRI

First YOG medals in gymnastics for :AUT,  :ISR, :NOR and Iran, of course

World Cup series
Aerobic gymnastics - first medal for :UKR
Artistic gymnastics - first ever medals for :GEO, :IND:MAR (and only the second time that :INA and :PHI earned medals, also a respectable fourth place for :KSA)

Rhythmic gymnastics - first medal for :EST (also a respectable fourth place for :MEX)

European Championships

First ever gold medal for :ITA in rhythmic gymnastics after being world champions numerous times.

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First world championships men's team finale for :NED:p 

 

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Em 12/11/2018 at 03:11, heywoodu disse:

First world championships men's team finale for :NED:p 

 


I tried to focus on medals. If we add "first time in the final" there would be a lot more to discuss.

 

Edited by thiago_simoes
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